Never hurts to research and recover those tiny details, sorry PC, but I’d never
would of figured it out if I wasn’t going through a re-read at the same time, so
well done! Hang on guys help is on the way!
Plans within plans eh?
panel 3.. gonna have to say the “raw wood” (OSB) is treated.!
osb would NOT last 3 days in that environment.. even Marine
grade, would have to be treated, before, during, and after
building,. and posted ‘no modifications’, nails or hangings,.!
I don’t believe even armorplas would survive long in that environment! Some
mosses and molds latch on anything and just starts to bore in. I doubt they’ll
figure out why they are there, or at least until Wilson shows up for training.
Yeah, That OSB will swell up and flake off fast, even if it’s pressure
treated or coated. Not to mention how easy it can be to get infections
in a hot swamp. The lake I used to swim in was like that, a simple
scuff on my ankle was enough for me to get an overnight infection that
almost cost me my foot! I went to work the next day and it swelled up
so bad that the ER had to cut my work boot off before it did any more
damage. No more swimming in that lake!! They injected the antibiotic
directly into the infection, NOT fun.
That depends on what kind of high-tech treatment the Lamians give it.
Maybe the dark-haired one is the Base Preservation Officer, and his
job is to walk around every day wearing a hot, sweaty gas mask and a
heavy, hot, sweaty backpack sprayer, spraying the buildings?
With a foul smelling biocide?
True, I’m just going by my mistake when I built a playhouse for my boys,
and mistakenly use OSB rather than plywood. I did seal it, and it still
went all flaky on me. It could be worse though, the old particle board,
(sawdust mixed with Elmers glue) that crap just melted.
They used that in mobile homes and modular homes up until ’86
Once again, we see that only the human leaders were the problem,
not the entire system. Bathe often you two, or YOU might notice
something fuzzy growing between you’re toes! or in other places
I won’t mention… (was going to say something else, but eewww.)
I’m glad it was the Pride, Now that toby on the moon can return
and resupply, 20 hours is dicey at best. The Pride had gone
toe-to-toe with Destroyers before and the P’teran ships are no
swamp buggies either. Plus, they might have the spare parts
they need to get Capt. Te’gin’s ship back up to snuff.
http://thegentlewolf.net/comic/tgw-1069/
That is the other ship, the Kirlan. The Arctos II is the result
of stripping the systems out of the original Arctos and installing
them in an Imperial destroyer hull. Captain Kte’rrt is enjoying
his new command. Once he gets used to it.
Ah so it’s the first of the hybrid ships, wow not bad! That ship
could do some VERY heavy damage. I wonder if the P’teran
Queen would want a new ship yard satellite built around P’tero
in the near future?
Yep. Before they left Ptero, Captain Chardis hired the two newest
ships as an escort. Since Captain Chardis and Captain Kte’rrt
already had a good relationship, the Arctos II was chosen as one
escort, and the other new ship is the second escort.
The diplomatic squadron consists of the IMS Catia’s Pride, the
destroyer PPS Arctos II, and the destroyer PPS Kirlan.
IMS = Imperial Merchant Ship.
PPS = Pteran Patrol Ship.
Good thing they are the hybrid ships. Since the core is still trying to “remind”
their “underlings” who’s boss, attacks like this last one will get more common.
They keep it up, they will lose key men and assets and will have a drain on
fleet might, which is fine, if they think that doing the same thing over and over
will change the results, it’s just making it easier to convince them to back down
and shut up. Unless they finally wake up and drag out the moth-balled ships
and even then it’ll take time to train the new crews, much less IF they have FTL
ships. I keep hoping someone will come up with a long range communication
suite. That would be as huge of an advantage as the grav drive.
Unfortunately, while wormhole transits provide for FTL travel, communication
is still stuck in the pre-radio days – possibly for good. Lightspeed (“C” i.e.
the velocity of propagation of electromagnetic radiation in a vacuum) is the
universal speed limit. Einstein postulated, and it has been amply proven, that
C is the velocity of propagation of information in the universe. Tachyons
are – so far – purely theoretical particles which have C as the lower limit of
their prop. Unless Petercat wants to allow a researcher to discover a way to
generate and sense tachyons, communication between systems is going to
have to be via couriered messages. It should be possible to produce automated
message drones. If built with he best Terran and P’teran stealth tech such a
device should have a decent chance of making it to its destination.
two things.. grivation Communiation (gc) is a thing. and quantum pairing.
(gc)’s real world problem is power. so with enough
power you could talk interstellar distances.
Einstein-Rosen bridge.. with a “stable” wormhole and paired quantum
tube communication at each end, instant communication is possible.
so.. with all the runs through the wormhole by the AI’s driven, weapons
test, they found the Lt. could talk/control through his body in real time.
at any distance.
The wormhole method might work, if you can reliably sent particle beams
(for example light flashes) through them and can place tiny versions “gentle
wolf style” wormholes close to both ends of your communication.
Or you’d place relays in close enough orbits around the existing WHs and
accept for in-system delays (signal from station to relay travel with light
speed as do signals between relays of two not connected wormholes within
a system).
For many needs, just sending AI driven courier vessels are probably the
more practical solution. (You get something like good ol’ pony express
mail service instead of instant messaging, but hey)
in the 2022 simulation (on a caltech supercomputer) using the
E-R bridge and a quantum pair, (effectively) sent a communication
between “Alice” on earth and “Bob” on Alpha Centauri, in real time..
Oh, and “gc” would not be FTL, by the – apart from requiring ridiculous
amounts of energy. (Colliding black holes for transferring single bits
of information style ridiculous)
in the “gc” theory (don’t have to means ((power)) to communicate
interstellar) the wave are not effected by anything, so can
effectively travel at the speed of light..
oops … maybe the Empire would be able to pull off gravitation communication
(sorry for the pun) at virtually no cost at all by using something like an oversized
grav gun directly aimed at the receiver?
How does the tech work at long range? Still point-to-point over stellar distances?
Or fanning out like a laser or radio signal would?
From what I’ve managed to understand Einstein’s theory was about moving mass to the
speed of light, while photons have no mass, My thought was about tachyons and the
quantum pairing might lead someone to produce a working beam that can be directed at
a long range target. A broadcast like a radio target might not work, and dropping buoy’s
in each system that could transceive those signals and convert them to local radio would
solve that problem. Both TOS and Enterprise series spoke of those communication buoys.
for subspace communications, I suspect the wormholes are using a type of subspace for
travel, and the same effect could be created for waves, if not particles in the near future.
star trek comm. wikki. they use “Subspace” (tech) to send instant
(tech) long range communications. by the wikki they send a signal
at 9.9997 warp speed. (60 times faster than any ‘warp’ ship). buoys;
effective range is 22.6ly,. so they drop a buoy at every 20ly.
@scar: the “speed limit” is not a property of mass or light moving through space,
it’s intrinsic to the fabric of space and time itself.
Tachyons are a mathematical solution to the equations used in Einstein’s theory,
but there’s no evidence supporting their actual existence.
Even if they existed, they would have to travel backwards in time (whatever that
means) and have very limited ways of interacting with normal matter (you can’t
decelerate them enough to “drop below light speed”, because that would be as
impossible as accelerating normal matter to FTL speed, they can not be charged
or they would be easily detectable by emitting https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherenkov_radiation ….)
It doesn’t matter. C is still the speed limit for information transfer. Quantum entanglement doesn’t
allow for FTL comm. It you do anything to one part of a quantum entangled pair it breaks the
entanglement so no method for FTL comm there. Sabine Hossenfelder has done a couple of videos
on quantum entanglement where she demonstrates/explains why quantum entanglement could not
be used for FTL comm. Sorry but interstellar comm is going to have to rely on messages being
carried. I believe a small, highly stealthy drone would make for efficient message transport.
Actually, Einstein’s “speed-limit” is specifically not about information
but about the way space and time (thus speed) work on a fundamental level.
Although, there’s one well-know effect that does not seem to be bound by
any notion of “spacial distance” and “time to reach destination” and
that’s quantum entanglement. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_entanglement
On the other hand, having “tachyon-or-whatever based subspace hyper-speed
communication” wouldn’t be the first holiday for physics-as-we-know-it in
this in this setting.
So, if there’s a place for it story-wise – why not?
The second article makes a good point about quantum entanglement not being
usable for actual information transfer.
Yes you do have pairs of “magically bound” particles, but the only thing you can
do with each pair is measure and thus determine the state exactly once.
If you measure the state of one entangle partner you learn the state of the other
one two. You can not *force* the particle (and therefore it’s partner) into one
specific state, you don’t even know if the other side has already performed the
measuring before you did.
Quantum physics is crazy like that. In that theory each particle exists in a superposition
of possible but unknown states until somebody tries to observe it.
It is only this action of observation that determines the actual state of the particle.
With entangled pairs of particles you know that one of them has state 0 and the
other has state 1 but you don’t actually know which is which and you can’t actually
force the result.
All you do know is that, on you side you got a certain result, and that the partners
on the remote side will reflect this result.
In other words: having – say – 1000 pairs of entangled particles you can “harvest”
1000 bit of randomness that are impossible for an outsider to guess, but known
to your communications partner.
Since these bits are totally random and a secret shared between two remote parties
you can use them for encrypting the rest of your data.
But that’s about it. You can’t force a certain state only observe the result of one single
measuring per particle. And you can’t monitor your own particle to notice when it’s
partner is measured either because if you did, that would require a series of#
measurements – the first of which would end the entanglement.
In real life, we know some of what gravity does, but we still don’t know what it IS,
in TGW, we have a group of scientists that figure out what gravity is and how to
produce a working simulation of it, which turned the Empire from another small, if not
advanced kingdom on the post-fall Earth. Because of that single discovery, it spans
many worlds and has many members through out known space. It’s not a hard
stretch to expect the huge brain-bank they have at their disposal would discover
another form of force that can break this barrier of communication! I understand
there are particles and waves, what if there’s a third state? The very thing that
allowed someone far into the past, to create the wormholes in the first place?
Remember the old superglue-the-hands scene?
It’s much more entertaining with sound: https://twitter.com/DanFriedman81/status/1680356974561488897
One suggestion was Mad Max style, and I love it:
“Just give them a hacksaw and tell them that flights will resume in five minutes.”
The common item to use when having to dissolve superglue is acetone,
AKA finger nail polish remover, it is a very mild skin irritant. It’s something
I heard from a hospital ER nurse. when it was first introduced, many
people came in to the ER because they glued themselves in some way,
most injuries were because those people panicked and tried to force
their skin apart, tearing it.
I really wish they’d stop doing this.
I can understand why thery’re doing it, but they’re giving their opposition an
all too easy reason to not take them serious.
It’s not just their existing opposition. They’re creating new opposition from the
ordinary people who might otherwise support their goals. They are not serious
about the elimination of fossil fuels, they’re street actors enjoying their own
show.
Translation:
Guy with cap: oh, oh, stop it, dammit, shit.
Firefighter: I’m not even on his finger or, he does that on purpose for attention
Guy with Cap: I don’t simulate shit at all
Firefighter: Now look at your colleagues.
I’m pretty sure most of them ARE serious about it.
Probably even desperate because of having to witness the same old play
of “Yeah it’s serious and we really have to do something about it – but
please not just yet. Let’s put it off until the majority of my voters die of old
age and your generation has to fix the mess we left you.”
It’s just they’re not really helping by making themselves an easily discarded
target.
If they were serious, they’d find a way that would actually accomplish
something. This isn’t it.
What serious people will do is research the art of persuasion to understand
the best way of convincing others to your point of view. The best salesmen
understand this.
These people are selling a product, screaming at your customers won’t work.
But how well did trying to persuade people work in the last 50 years?
Club of Rome has been in the ’70s
Talking about how we should really stop killing off our own foundation is nothing new either.
If your in your twenties and “environmentally inclined” you’re bound to realize that
all those who are in charge are at least 50 years of age, if not in their late 70s.
You realize that to them putting things off for yet another decade might sound like
an option.
Simple math. If you’re at least moderately well off (read: you can afford an air conditioning
for your home), and above fifty years of age ,,, it’s all to easy to postpone reacting to a
situation that will make life hard (or impossible) sometime late in this century.
Kids who realize that “the old ones” are only interested in their own wealth and life
tend to find less-than-ideal ways to voice their concerns.
Yes, wealthy old people don’t care about anything but profit.
That’s why there are no emission or safety standards on motor
vehicles, power plants, or industry.
Oh, wait.
The powerful did not impose those controls and standards because a bunch
of young people screamed at them, called them names, disrupted other people’s
lives, or destroyed property.
Those standards and controls were imposed because the powerful were
persuaded that they were needed.
We need something more credible than always false claims of disaster
in five – ten – twelve years to make the effort.
We need verifiable, repeatable science for that. Science that has been
proven in the crucible of dissent, not imposed by diktat, by silencing
opposition.
Nobody pays attention to the screaming of children.
Your examples are a bit different in that immediate actions show immediate
result and have immediate consequences, where as when battling climate change,
immediate actions have immediate consequences – but only long term results.
Maybe this example will help to show my point:
A few years back our government had pompously pronounced “master plan” for
climate policy with measures to be taken over the next several decades.
Our “supreme court” declared this to be an unfair burden for future generation,
because there were almost no immediate measures but only commitments to
executed in twenty or thirty years.
In other words: if the problem is real, than you should address it, like now.
If it isn’t you shouldn’t burden the next generation with drastic regulations.
But don’t tell the people they can eat the cake now and let their kids have
it later.
As I said: while I do understand how they might feel frustrated,
I do not think that kids gluing themselves to roads or airports
is getting them anywhere.
And Scarsdale had the correct guess!
Catia’s Pride for the win.
Never hurts to research and recover those tiny details, sorry PC, but I’d never
would of figured it out if I wasn’t going through a re-read at the same time, so
well done! Hang on guys help is on the way!
Plans within plans eh?
panel 3.. gonna have to say the “raw wood” (OSB) is treated.!
osb would NOT last 3 days in that environment.. even Marine
grade, would have to be treated, before, during, and after
building,. and posted ‘no modifications’, nails or hangings,.!
I don’t believe even armorplas would survive long in that environment! Some
mosses and molds latch on anything and just starts to bore in. I doubt they’ll
figure out why they are there, or at least until Wilson shows up for training.
Yeah, That OSB will swell up and flake off fast, even if it’s pressure
treated or coated. Not to mention how easy it can be to get infections
in a hot swamp. The lake I used to swim in was like that, a simple
scuff on my ankle was enough for me to get an overnight infection that
almost cost me my foot! I went to work the next day and it swelled up
so bad that the ER had to cut my work boot off before it did any more
damage. No more swimming in that lake!! They injected the antibiotic
directly into the infection, NOT fun.
That depends on what kind of high-tech treatment the Lamians give it.
Maybe the dark-haired one is the Base Preservation Officer, and his
job is to walk around every day wearing a hot, sweaty gas mask and a
heavy, hot, sweaty backpack sprayer, spraying the buildings?
With a foul smelling biocide?
IF real Army,. they would both be in “Quartermaster” MOS 92.
92S would be laundry..
92Ax would be groundskeeper..
True, I’m just going by my mistake when I built a playhouse for my boys,
and mistakenly use OSB rather than plywood. I did seal it, and it still
went all flaky on me. It could be worse though, the old particle board,
(sawdust mixed with Elmers glue) that crap just melted.
They used that in mobile homes and modular homes up until ’86
Swing? I wish! swim*
fixed
thanks
Once again, we see that only the human leaders were the problem,
not the entire system. Bathe often you two, or YOU might notice
something fuzzy growing between you’re toes! or in other places
I won’t mention… (was going to say something else, but eewww.)
I’m glad it was the Pride, Now that toby on the moon can return
and resupply, 20 hours is dicey at best. The Pride had gone
toe-to-toe with Destroyers before and the P’teran ships are no
swamp buggies either. Plus, they might have the spare parts
they need to get Capt. Te’gin’s ship back up to snuff.
The Sparrow has two Tobies,
and they’ve been swapping out on sensor watch.
Did you notice the name of the Pteran ship?
“Arctos II”. Significance?
http://thegentlewolf.net/comic/tgw-1069/
That is the other ship, the Kirlan. The Arctos II is the result
of stripping the systems out of the original Arctos and installing
them in an Imperial destroyer hull. Captain Kte’rrt is enjoying
his new command. Once he gets used to it.
Ah so it’s the first of the hybrid ships, wow not bad! That ship
could do some VERY heavy damage. I wonder if the P’teran
Queen would want a new ship yard satellite built around P’tero
in the near future?
Yep. Before they left Ptero, Captain Chardis hired the two newest
ships as an escort. Since Captain Chardis and Captain Kte’rrt
already had a good relationship, the Arctos II was chosen as one
escort, and the other new ship is the second escort.
The diplomatic squadron consists of the IMS Catia’s Pride, the
destroyer PPS Arctos II, and the destroyer PPS Kirlan.
IMS = Imperial Merchant Ship.
PPS = Pteran Patrol Ship.
Good thing they are the hybrid ships. Since the core is still trying to “remind”
their “underlings” who’s boss, attacks like this last one will get more common.
They keep it up, they will lose key men and assets and will have a drain on
fleet might, which is fine, if they think that doing the same thing over and over
will change the results, it’s just making it easier to convince them to back down
and shut up. Unless they finally wake up and drag out the moth-balled ships
and even then it’ll take time to train the new crews, much less IF they have FTL
ships. I keep hoping someone will come up with a long range communication
suite. That would be as huge of an advantage as the grav drive.
Unfortunately, while wormhole transits provide for FTL travel, communication
is still stuck in the pre-radio days – possibly for good. Lightspeed (“C” i.e.
the velocity of propagation of electromagnetic radiation in a vacuum) is the
universal speed limit. Einstein postulated, and it has been amply proven, that
C is the velocity of propagation of information in the universe. Tachyons
are – so far – purely theoretical particles which have C as the lower limit of
their prop. Unless Petercat wants to allow a researcher to discover a way to
generate and sense tachyons, communication between systems is going to
have to be via couriered messages. It should be possible to produce automated
message drones. If built with he best Terran and P’teran stealth tech such a
device should have a decent chance of making it to its destination.
two things.. grivation Communiation (gc) is a thing. and quantum pairing.
(gc)’s real world problem is power. so with enough
power you could talk interstellar distances.
Einstein-Rosen bridge.. with a “stable” wormhole and paired quantum
tube communication at each end, instant communication is possible.
so.. with all the runs through the wormhole by the AI’s driven, weapons
test, they found the Lt. could talk/control through his body in real time.
at any distance.
The wormhole method might work, if you can reliably sent particle beams
(for example light flashes) through them and can place tiny versions “gentle
wolf style” wormholes close to both ends of your communication.
Or you’d place relays in close enough orbits around the existing WHs and
accept for in-system delays (signal from station to relay travel with light
speed as do signals between relays of two not connected wormholes within
a system).
For many needs, just sending AI driven courier vessels are probably the
more practical solution. (You get something like good ol’ pony express
mail service instead of instant messaging, but hey)
in the 2022 simulation (on a caltech supercomputer) using the
E-R bridge and a quantum pair, (effectively) sent a communication
between “Alice” on earth and “Bob” on Alpha Centauri, in real time..
Oh, and “gc” would not be FTL, by the – apart from requiring ridiculous
amounts of energy. (Colliding black holes for transferring single bits
of information style ridiculous)
in the “gc” theory (don’t have to means ((power)) to communicate
interstellar) the wave are not effected by anything, so can
effectively travel at the speed of light..
oops … maybe the Empire would be able to pull off gravitation communication
(sorry for the pun) at virtually no cost at all by using something like an oversized
grav gun directly aimed at the receiver?
How does the tech work at long range? Still point-to-point over stellar distances?
Or fanning out like a laser or radio signal would?
From what I’ve managed to understand Einstein’s theory was about moving mass to the
speed of light, while photons have no mass, My thought was about tachyons and the
quantum pairing might lead someone to produce a working beam that can be directed at
a long range target. A broadcast like a radio target might not work, and dropping buoy’s
in each system that could transceive those signals and convert them to local radio would
solve that problem. Both TOS and Enterprise series spoke of those communication buoys.
for subspace communications, I suspect the wormholes are using a type of subspace for
travel, and the same effect could be created for waves, if not particles in the near future.
star trek comm. wikki. they use “Subspace” (tech) to send instant
(tech) long range communications. by the wikki they send a signal
at 9.9997 warp speed. (60 times faster than any ‘warp’ ship). buoys;
effective range is 22.6ly,. so they drop a buoy at every 20ly.
@scar: the “speed limit” is not a property of mass or light moving through space,
it’s intrinsic to the fabric of space and time itself.
Tachyons are a mathematical solution to the equations used in Einstein’s theory,
but there’s no evidence supporting their actual existence.
Even if they existed, they would have to travel backwards in time (whatever that
means) and have very limited ways of interacting with normal matter (you can’t
decelerate them enough to “drop below light speed”, because that would be as
impossible as accelerating normal matter to FTL speed, they can not be charged
or they would be easily detectable by emitting
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherenkov_radiation ….)
It doesn’t matter. C is still the speed limit for information transfer. Quantum entanglement doesn’t
allow for FTL comm. It you do anything to one part of a quantum entangled pair it breaks the
entanglement so no method for FTL comm there. Sabine Hossenfelder has done a couple of videos
on quantum entanglement where she demonstrates/explains why quantum entanglement could not
be used for FTL comm. Sorry but interstellar comm is going to have to rely on messages being
carried. I believe a small, highly stealthy drone would make for efficient message transport.
Actually, Einstein’s “speed-limit” is specifically not about information
but about the way space and time (thus speed) work on a fundamental level.
Although, there’s one well-know effect that does not seem to be bound by
any notion of “spacial distance” and “time to reach destination” and
that’s quantum entanglement.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_entanglement
(Alas, while this has been proven to be useful for sharing a short random
number “secret” it’d impossible to actually encoded meaningful data that way)
https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2020/01/02/no-we-still-cant-use-quantum-entanglement-to-communicate-faster-than-light/
On the other hand, having “tachyon-or-whatever based subspace hyper-speed
communication” wouldn’t be the first holiday for physics-as-we-know-it in
this in this setting.
So, if there’s a place for it story-wise – why not?
basically what we are saying is,. YES. with enough
“scifi tech hand wave” AND real world “theory”,.
PC can have a FTL comm system.!
The second article makes a good point about quantum entanglement not being
usable for actual information transfer.
Yes you do have pairs of “magically bound” particles, but the only thing you can
do with each pair is measure and thus determine the state exactly once.
If you measure the state of one entangle partner you learn the state of the other
one two. You can not *force* the particle (and therefore it’s partner) into one
specific state, you don’t even know if the other side has already performed the
measuring before you did.
Quantum physics is crazy like that. In that theory each particle exists in a superposition
of possible but unknown states until somebody tries to observe it.
It is only this action of observation that determines the actual state of the particle.
With entangled pairs of particles you know that one of them has state 0 and the
other has state 1 but you don’t actually know which is which and you can’t actually
force the result.
All you do know is that, on you side you got a certain result, and that the partners
on the remote side will reflect this result.
In other words: having – say – 1000 pairs of entangled particles you can “harvest”
1000 bit of randomness that are impossible for an outsider to guess, but known
to your communications partner.
Since these bits are totally random and a secret shared between two remote parties
you can use them for encrypting the rest of your data.
But that’s about it. You can’t force a certain state only observe the result of one single
measuring per particle. And you can’t monitor your own particle to notice when it’s
partner is measured either because if you did, that would require a series of#
measurements – the first of which would end the entanglement.
No I didn’t until now, thanks Bill.
In real life, we know some of what gravity does, but we still don’t know what it IS,
in TGW, we have a group of scientists that figure out what gravity is and how to
produce a working simulation of it, which turned the Empire from another small, if not
advanced kingdom on the post-fall Earth. Because of that single discovery, it spans
many worlds and has many members through out known space. It’s not a hard
stretch to expect the huge brain-bank they have at their disposal would discover
another form of force that can break this barrier of communication! I understand
there are particles and waves, what if there’s a third state? The very thing that
allowed someone far into the past, to create the wormholes in the first place?
Remember the old superglue-the-hands scene?
It’s much more entertaining with sound:
https://twitter.com/DanFriedman81/status/1680356974561488897
One suggestion was Mad Max style, and I love it:
“Just give them a hacksaw and tell them that flights will resume in five minutes.”
The common item to use when having to dissolve superglue is acetone,
AKA finger nail polish remover, it is a very mild skin irritant. It’s something
I heard from a hospital ER nurse. when it was first introduced, many
people came in to the ER because they glued themselves in some way,
most injuries were because those people panicked and tried to force
their skin apart, tearing it.
If it’s about kids glueing themselves to roads:
I really wish they’d stop doing this.
I can understand why thery’re doing it, but they’re giving their opposition an
all too easy reason to not take them serious.
It’s not just their existing opposition. They’re creating new opposition from the
ordinary people who might otherwise support their goals. They are not serious
about the elimination of fossil fuels, they’re street actors enjoying their own
show.
Translation:
Guy with cap: oh, oh, stop it, dammit, shit.
Firefighter: I’m not even on his finger or, he does that on purpose for attention
Guy with Cap: I don’t simulate shit at all
Firefighter: Now look at your colleagues.
I’m pretty sure most of them ARE serious about it.
Probably even desperate because of having to witness the same old play
of “Yeah it’s serious and we really have to do something about it – but
please not just yet. Let’s put it off until the majority of my voters die of old
age and your generation has to fix the mess we left you.”
It’s just they’re not really helping by making themselves an easily discarded
target.
If they were serious, they’d find a way that would actually accomplish
something. This isn’t it.
What serious people will do is research the art of persuasion to understand
the best way of convincing others to your point of view. The best salesmen
understand this.
These people are selling a product, screaming at your customers won’t work.
Yes, I won’t.
But how well did trying to persuade people work in the last 50 years?
Club of Rome has been in the ’70s
Talking about how we should really stop killing off our own foundation is nothing new either.
If your in your twenties and “environmentally inclined” you’re bound to realize that
all those who are in charge are at least 50 years of age, if not in their late 70s.
You realize that to them putting things off for yet another decade might sound like
an option.
Simple math. If you’re at least moderately well off (read: you can afford an air conditioning
for your home), and above fifty years of age ,,, it’s all to easy to postpone reacting to a
situation that will make life hard (or impossible) sometime late in this century.
Kids who realize that “the old ones” are only interested in their own wealth and life
tend to find less-than-ideal ways to voice their concerns.
Yes, wealthy old people don’t care about anything but profit.
That’s why there are no emission or safety standards on motor
vehicles, power plants, or industry.
Oh, wait.
The powerful did not impose those controls and standards because a bunch
of young people screamed at them, called them names, disrupted other people’s
lives, or destroyed property.
Those standards and controls were imposed because the powerful were
persuaded that they were needed.
We need something more credible than always false claims of disaster
in five – ten – twelve years to make the effort.
We need verifiable, repeatable science for that. Science that has been
proven in the crucible of dissent, not imposed by diktat, by silencing
opposition.
Nobody pays attention to the screaming of children.
Your examples are a bit different in that immediate actions show immediate
result and have immediate consequences, where as when battling climate change,
immediate actions have immediate consequences – but only long term results.
Maybe this example will help to show my point:
A few years back our government had pompously pronounced “master plan” for
climate policy with measures to be taken over the next several decades.
Our “supreme court” declared this to be an unfair burden for future generation,
because there were almost no immediate measures but only commitments to
executed in twenty or thirty years.
In other words: if the problem is real, than you should address it, like now.
If it isn’t you shouldn’t burden the next generation with drastic regulations.
But don’t tell the people they can eat the cake now and let their kids have
it later.
Typos:
put it off
voters die of old age
Fixed.
thx
Anyway.
As I said: while I do understand how they might feel frustrated,
I do not think that kids gluing themselves to roads or airports
is getting them anywhere.
FYI: Tornado sirens went off, if you don’t hear from me, you’ll know why.