I’m so used to people hearing about the Cats’ I forgot that outlying
areas haven’t as yet. Seth and Diana will have many interesting
conversations coming up… We’ll see her character from that alone.
I think Diana will be ok, she didn’t seem to react to the Sgt.
Nope, it’s a sim, if it was real they would of ran in and took over
after that. Ah well, should they had been told about the problem?
Not really, anyone that’s fired a gun would know that, I get the
impression few of the Bun’s have. at least they learned it in a sim,
rather in combat. Friendly fire is very real and many raw privates
have made that mistake, not checked downrange before firing.
That always had me wonder in the comic book days, when the
hero and villain are fighting and miss each other, where does
those misses go? Anywhere they want… When shooting at an
enemy, always look behind them and assume you’ll hit that instead!
President Elect Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH Neanderthal B Woodman Domestic Violent Extremist SuperStraight
Yes, you still want to verify what’s behind your intended
(enemy) target, to make sure that it’s nothing friendly.
And if you shoot at your enemy, and miss, you’ll still
hit something vital. It’s a target rich environment.
Sad thing is, many times when friendly fire happens, it gets
covered up, even by the press, Both my father and a friend’s
father have told me stories about it. Inexperienced troops
that wildly fire in a panic (including guards at their posts)
and kill someone. I’d not want that memory myself…
“comic book days” and cartoons.. in the 70’s the media had a very big
impact on violence in TV and comics. as in they were NOT allowed to
talk about, show, or after effects.! ( who remembers ‘G.I. Joe’s’,
exploding helicopter with ALL the crew parachuting out.?) or the
ultra violent batman, who never turned in a criminal,. before his more
friendly redesign..
this was also due to TV’s becoming kids sitters. (the early 70’s kids
had 2 or 3 hours max, usually with the family vs the 80’s kid having
minimum 4 hours a day of TV.)
There is still the question of what happened to the missile and its performance.
Will the Toby’s be able to dodge all the shrapnel?
Well my predictions for this comic weren’t exactly right; maybe the next comic!
If a ship goes into stealth is its mass still detectable?
If not, what safeguards do the grav missiles have in the event of a miss.
Can the grav missiles distinguish a small target (say a ship) from a larger target
(say a planet) behind it? (scale up or down as the situation requires).
What safeguards do the grav missiles have if they miss? Can they miss?
Once they’re locked on, the gravity drive doesn’t let go. At least that’s
my understanding, worth every penny you paid for it.
Mass detection is an off-shoot of the grav tech, the core might have it,
but so far there’s no indication of it. Most the core has shown so far is
EM field, enhanced light-range visual, and infrared. Even the P’teran
ships can be detected by the mass detector. IF you know where to point
it at.
If I understand right, they are “dumb” missiles, they might have a self-destruct
but once the charge goes off there’s nothing that can be done about it. Just
dodge the scatter shot. They are a great offensive weapon, but have risks.
The original grav missiles had guidance, but the empire soon switched
to the much cheaper and faster to manufacture unguided ones.
The question becomes what sets off the fragmentation charge
(which presumably is large enough to disable or destroy the Grav drive)
It is my understanding that is proximity to the target, so what happens
if the target is an FTL ship and it goes FTL after the missile is launched
but before the missile arrives?
There’s a lot of factors to consider there, how close the missile was,
what else was in the same vector, would it try to follow that ship,
if it was close enough to enter the FLT drive effective area, and how
fast the missile was moving. If it’s going fast enough for time dialation
to have an effect, it would seem to the target that it flashed to it if so.
I’m sure if they were to escape that way, and the missile(s) were
going off randomly, they would be able to either shut it down and
recover it, or just self-destruct it. Ultimately It would be up to PC on
how that would go, but these are all conventional ships, it going to
take quite a bit to get the core to risk their FTL ships on the Empire,
for good reason. You don’t bring out your best weapon unless you
know the others just won’t work. Plus the risk of the tech being stolen.
Sometimes just revealing the tech exists might be enough
for the other side to research it and eventually get. I’m
pretty sure if we could observe a ship with working FTL
drive engage it, our scientists would figure it out. Once
you know something is possible and can observe some
effects, the rest is just a matter of time and a few genius
minds to figure out.
The Empire was using that idea to their advantage, having sound makers
and bogus lights to confuse any on-lookers as to what and how it worked.
While I doubt they thought of it, the core could use the same misdirection.
The core’s biggest mistake is thinking that no one is smarter or trickier
than them, and that’s a fatal mistake. The Chinese thought that, and they
got nothing for it, except a dead Prince and a semi-defected ambassador…
And a couple of operatives that DID defect! “Foolish Americans” my left nut…
True, and the Grav missile are detectable as they glow in the
infra red once their super cooled launch state absorbs enough heat
from the excess energy the drives produces.
But by then the missiles are fractional C, so would a normal scan pick them up
or reject the signal as an instrument glitch?
Also remember as far as we know this is a simulation that I think has three stages
and we are still in the first (easy) stage. The FTL ships (if I am right)
don’t appear until the third (impossible) stage.
FTL attack mode;
FTL ships arrive via the wormhole as that is the fastest way between star systems.
One or more ship killer missiles are sent through and explode on clearing the wormhole
(could even be a cluster bomb) If the ships can go through in stealth mode this step redundant.
On arrival it has a slight advantage over close by ships (negated if they are in stealth mode)
due to light speed. Launches a salvo at any detectable targets the missiles can reach.
Single ship FTL attack,
if no targets jumps towards where targets are expected to be. Repeat until targets found.
If targets seen jumps to a closer position at a different angle of attack and again launches
Rinse and repeat until target destroyed.
Small fleet FTL attack, as for single ship but each ship sends a message torpedo
back through the wormhole so the next ship through knows what is going on.
Large fleet FTL attack;
Ships go through the wormhole as fast as practical
as soon as the electronics clear each ship makes an automatic FTL to a predetermined
positions that en-globes the system and far enough out to make detection unlikely.
Wait long enough for everyone to be in position (the biggest delay should be how long
it takes the fleet to transit the wormhole.
FTL jump a set distance closer in, with a random 10-15 degree offset from their
initial direction (so the re-entry position could not be predicted) taking out targets as they find them.
Notes; this assumes the core do not know the empire can detect the mass of a ship
(and thus its direction if not actual position) even if it is cloaked.
While the model ship on the bench was as FTL ship in the originator’s world
does no necessarily mea it s one in PC’s world
I don’t mean to nit-pik but in no way does that require the use of FTL, everything
is still using the WH. I could see using the WH to get close the system to shorten
the trip, FTL to the target using stealth, and move in to get into position. Scout
the area, and use FTL to get away from the system far enough to hide just in case,
use stealth to to return to launch a torpedo through the WH to report back, and
FTL home.
For a full scale use a single or a few scouts to take up positions to mark a spot for
the main fleet to arrive using FTL, regroup and enter the system using stealth,
en-globe the planet with a few ships guarding the backs of those ships in case
of defenders attacking the fleet.
FTL is a safer way to travel to a system without being detected or crippled by the
WH effect on electronics. The best use would be to en-globe the WH to allow
conventional ships to use it safely, while they recover defend the ships until
they can join in and beat back the defenders to their planet.
To be honest, I have a weak hunch that the P’tera either are housing the FTL
ships, or know the location. That is the only time we have seen that model
anywhere, so they may have been the one’s to develop it, or had a hand in it.
It would also explain why the core was SO upset that P’tera were being friendly
to the Empire, worried that the Queen would impart their most guarded secret!
Which is very dumb, their attacks may cause the very betrayal they think has
happened.
Nit Pick away! – If my ideas have a hole in the logic I want to hear them
But consider this;
As far as we know this is the early stage of a multi-level simulation
of an attack by the core and as such represent what the Empire thinks
the core would have and do at each level. For the final level that will be
an FTL attack using what the Empire thinks the core knows about them
and is based on two premises;
The fastest and least energy use way to travel between worlds is via
the wormholes and the core do not know the Empire has mass detection.
Any system without mass detection would see an FTL ship come through
and immediately vanish. The defenders would think the ship(s) had immediately
gone into stealth and concentrate their scans in that direction to find them,
at the same time moving their defense fleets according to the perceived threat.
And that is what the Empire thinks the Core would think they would do!
Of coarse the AI running the simulation could decide on the worst case scenerio
and have the FTL ship(s) by FTL drive anyway
Modified attack mode I hadn’t though of earlier; A ship arrives by FTL and clears
any ships defending the WH; allowing the main invasion fleet to enter via the WH.
This has a practical effect often. I was thinking of the missile defense
shooting ramping up recently. Having field of fire areas set up so that
most missed shots miss landing on valuable assets inside the border
or all fall on enemy territory where no friendly assets are located. It is
a plan well worth including. All people firing any weapons must consider
where the payload will land. That starts with the single person firing a
personal weapon on to spray and prays, machine guns, and weapons
like used during WW2 aerial attacks. Those AA weapons can do great
damages to nearby ships. Any weapon must hit the intended target as
much as possible.
En-globing an enemy is a domination tactic, but any good strategist knows the risks,
actually a 160-170 degree dome is more effective, that way the defenders can safely
fire without the risk of friendly assets taking fire, and the enemy is stopped from
advancing on their target. As long as any change in vector is met with fire.
The Imperial fleets have the advantage with their grav-based weapons since once
locked on, it would take blind luck or an act of god to save them. The core leaders
still think it was the captains’ fault or dumb luck that the Imperial fleet has had so
much luck against them. The only thing that will help the core is the FTL ships that
they have, IF they can make very short jumps away. Since they use fusion reaction
to power their ships, they can’t do it often or risk being out of fuel in a battle zone.
Interesting Question; what would happen if a nuke was exploded inside a WH?
Cause the WH to flare as if a large ship had transited
Destroy the WH temporarily/permanently
Move the WH somewhere else in the systems
or connect a different pair of systems
Send a burst of EMF radiation around the WH (at one or both ends)
I have wondered about the WH’s and how they were created, and if there was a way
using the grav tech to disrupt or even close a WH with it. they are basically a black hole
that has connected to another in the same universe, or with a couple between universes,
I don’t know, there is so little understanding of how they work, how they are created,
to attempt to affect one. It’s like watching an ape try to figure out how to use a laptop,
do you smash the keys, jump on it, or throw poop at it?
As far as a nuke goes, it’s just as likely the force of the blast at best, would just travel
through it and get adsorbed in the other universe rather than travel through. The WH
is massive, the “safe” part they use isn’t the full size. Picture a tunnel you can drive
through a mountain, the tunnel is the part you can travel in, but the tunnel is part
of the mountain. A black hole is the mountain, the tunnel is the WH. the biggest nuke
we could make would be no more than a blasting cap to it. Sure you might knock a
few rocks loose, even cause an avalanche and block it, but it would take a lot more
to close it completely. which would explain why no WH goes to a system that has had
a supernova go off in.
white holes are pure theory! no one has a workable idea..
WH are a pure guess.! “If a BH exists that a WH has too.”
BH = nothing escapes.. WH = nothing can get in.
I’m so used to people hearing about the Cats’ I forgot that outlying
areas haven’t as yet. Seth and Diana will have many interesting
conversations coming up… We’ll see her character from that alone.
I think Diana will be ok, she didn’t seem to react to the Sgt.
Nope, it’s a sim, if it was real they would of ran in and took over
after that. Ah well, should they had been told about the problem?
Not really, anyone that’s fired a gun would know that, I get the
impression few of the Bun’s have. at least they learned it in a sim,
rather in combat. Friendly fire is very real and many raw privates
have made that mistake, not checked downrange before firing.
That always had me wonder in the comic book days, when the
hero and villain are fighting and miss each other, where does
those misses go? Anywhere they want… When shooting at an
enemy, always look behind them and assume you’ll hit that instead!
Remember, “friendly fire, isn’t”.
Yes, you still want to verify what’s behind your intended
(enemy) target, to make sure that it’s nothing friendly.
And if you shoot at your enemy, and miss, you’ll still
hit something vital. It’s a target rich environment.
Sad thing is, many times when friendly fire happens, it gets
covered up, even by the press, Both my father and a friend’s
father have told me stories about it. Inexperienced troops
that wildly fire in a panic (including guards at their posts)
and kill someone. I’d not want that memory myself…
“comic book days” and cartoons.. in the 70’s the media had a very big
impact on violence in TV and comics. as in they were NOT allowed to
talk about, show, or after effects.! ( who remembers ‘G.I. Joe’s’,
exploding helicopter with ALL the crew parachuting out.?) or the
ultra violent batman, who never turned in a criminal,. before his more
friendly redesign..
this was also due to TV’s becoming kids sitters. (the early 70’s kids
had 2 or 3 hours max, usually with the family vs the 80’s kid having
minimum 4 hours a day of TV.)
There is still the question of what happened to the missile and its performance.
Will the Toby’s be able to dodge all the shrapnel?
Well my predictions for this comic weren’t exactly right; maybe the next comic!
If a ship goes into stealth is its mass still detectable?
If not, what safeguards do the grav missiles have in the event of a miss.
Can the grav missiles distinguish a small target (say a ship) from a larger target
(say a planet) behind it? (scale up or down as the situation requires).
What safeguards do the grav missiles have if they miss? Can they miss?
Once they’re locked on, the gravity drive doesn’t let go. At least that’s
my understanding, worth every penny you paid for it.
Mass detection is an off-shoot of the grav tech, the core might have it,
but so far there’s no indication of it. Most the core has shown so far is
EM field, enhanced light-range visual, and infrared. Even the P’teran
ships can be detected by the mass detector. IF you know where to point
it at.
If I understand right, they are “dumb” missiles, they might have a self-destruct
but once the charge goes off there’s nothing that can be done about it. Just
dodge the scatter shot. They are a great offensive weapon, but have risks.
The original grav missiles had guidance, but the empire soon switched
to the much cheaper and faster to manufacture unguided ones.
The question becomes what sets off the fragmentation charge
(which presumably is large enough to disable or destroy the Grav drive)
It is my understanding that is proximity to the target, so what happens
if the target is an FTL ship and it goes FTL after the missile is launched
but before the missile arrives?
There’s a lot of factors to consider there, how close the missile was,
what else was in the same vector, would it try to follow that ship,
if it was close enough to enter the FLT drive effective area, and how
fast the missile was moving. If it’s going fast enough for time dialation
to have an effect, it would seem to the target that it flashed to it if so.
I’m sure if they were to escape that way, and the missile(s) were
going off randomly, they would be able to either shut it down and
recover it, or just self-destruct it. Ultimately It would be up to PC on
how that would go, but these are all conventional ships, it going to
take quite a bit to get the core to risk their FTL ships on the Empire,
for good reason. You don’t bring out your best weapon unless you
know the others just won’t work. Plus the risk of the tech being stolen.
Sometimes just revealing the tech exists might be enough
for the other side to research it and eventually get. I’m
pretty sure if we could observe a ship with working FTL
drive engage it, our scientists would figure it out. Once
you know something is possible and can observe some
effects, the rest is just a matter of time and a few genius
minds to figure out.
The Empire was using that idea to their advantage, having sound makers
and bogus lights to confuse any on-lookers as to what and how it worked.
While I doubt they thought of it, the core could use the same misdirection.
The core’s biggest mistake is thinking that no one is smarter or trickier
than them, and that’s a fatal mistake. The Chinese thought that, and they
got nothing for it, except a dead Prince and a semi-defected ambassador…
And a couple of operatives that DID defect! “Foolish Americans” my left nut…
True, and the Grav missile are detectable as they glow in the
infra red once their super cooled launch state absorbs enough heat
from the excess energy the drives produces.
But by then the missiles are fractional C, so would a normal scan pick them up
or reject the signal as an instrument glitch?
Also remember as far as we know this is a simulation that I think has three stages
and we are still in the first (easy) stage. The FTL ships (if I am right)
don’t appear until the third (impossible) stage.
FTL attack mode;
FTL ships arrive via the wormhole as that is the fastest way between star systems.
One or more ship killer missiles are sent through and explode on clearing the wormhole
(could even be a cluster bomb) If the ships can go through in stealth mode this step redundant.
On arrival it has a slight advantage over close by ships (negated if they are in stealth mode)
due to light speed. Launches a salvo at any detectable targets the missiles can reach.
Single ship FTL attack,
if no targets jumps towards where targets are expected to be. Repeat until targets found.
If targets seen jumps to a closer position at a different angle of attack and again launches
Rinse and repeat until target destroyed.
Small fleet FTL attack, as for single ship but each ship sends a message torpedo
back through the wormhole so the next ship through knows what is going on.
Large fleet FTL attack;
Ships go through the wormhole as fast as practical
as soon as the electronics clear each ship makes an automatic FTL to a predetermined
positions that en-globes the system and far enough out to make detection unlikely.
Wait long enough for everyone to be in position (the biggest delay should be how long
it takes the fleet to transit the wormhole.
FTL jump a set distance closer in, with a random 10-15 degree offset from their
initial direction (so the re-entry position could not be predicted) taking out targets as they find them.
Notes; this assumes the core do not know the empire can detect the mass of a ship
(and thus its direction if not actual position) even if it is cloaked.
While the model ship on the bench was as FTL ship in the originator’s world
does no necessarily mea it s one in PC’s world
I don’t mean to nit-pik but in no way does that require the use of FTL, everything
is still using the WH. I could see using the WH to get close the system to shorten
the trip, FTL to the target using stealth, and move in to get into position. Scout
the area, and use FTL to get away from the system far enough to hide just in case,
use stealth to to return to launch a torpedo through the WH to report back, and
FTL home.
For a full scale use a single or a few scouts to take up positions to mark a spot for
the main fleet to arrive using FTL, regroup and enter the system using stealth,
en-globe the planet with a few ships guarding the backs of those ships in case
of defenders attacking the fleet.
FTL is a safer way to travel to a system without being detected or crippled by the
WH effect on electronics. The best use would be to en-globe the WH to allow
conventional ships to use it safely, while they recover defend the ships until
they can join in and beat back the defenders to their planet.
To be honest, I have a weak hunch that the P’tera either are housing the FTL
ships, or know the location. That is the only time we have seen that model
anywhere, so they may have been the one’s to develop it, or had a hand in it.
It would also explain why the core was SO upset that P’tera were being friendly
to the Empire, worried that the Queen would impart their most guarded secret!
Which is very dumb, their attacks may cause the very betrayal they think has
happened.
Nit Pick away! – If my ideas have a hole in the logic I want to hear them
But consider this;
As far as we know this is the early stage of a multi-level simulation
of an attack by the core and as such represent what the Empire thinks
the core would have and do at each level. For the final level that will be
an FTL attack using what the Empire thinks the core knows about them
and is based on two premises;
The fastest and least energy use way to travel between worlds is via
the wormholes and the core do not know the Empire has mass detection.
Any system without mass detection would see an FTL ship come through
and immediately vanish. The defenders would think the ship(s) had immediately
gone into stealth and concentrate their scans in that direction to find them,
at the same time moving their defense fleets according to the perceived threat.
And that is what the Empire thinks the Core would think they would do!
Of coarse the AI running the simulation could decide on the worst case scenerio
and have the FTL ship(s) by FTL drive anyway
Modified attack mode I hadn’t though of earlier; A ship arrives by FTL and clears
any ships defending the WH; allowing the main invasion fleet to enter via the WH.
This has a practical effect often. I was thinking of the missile defense
shooting ramping up recently. Having field of fire areas set up so that
most missed shots miss landing on valuable assets inside the border
or all fall on enemy territory where no friendly assets are located. It is
a plan well worth including. All people firing any weapons must consider
where the payload will land. That starts with the single person firing a
personal weapon on to spray and prays, machine guns, and weapons
like used during WW2 aerial attacks. Those AA weapons can do great
damages to nearby ships. Any weapon must hit the intended target as
much as possible.
En-globing an enemy is a domination tactic, but any good strategist knows the risks,
actually a 160-170 degree dome is more effective, that way the defenders can safely
fire without the risk of friendly assets taking fire, and the enemy is stopped from
advancing on their target. As long as any change in vector is met with fire.
The Imperial fleets have the advantage with their grav-based weapons since once
locked on, it would take blind luck or an act of god to save them. The core leaders
still think it was the captains’ fault or dumb luck that the Imperial fleet has had so
much luck against them. The only thing that will help the core is the FTL ships that
they have, IF they can make very short jumps away. Since they use fusion reaction
to power their ships, they can’t do it often or risk being out of fuel in a battle zone.
Interesting Question; what would happen if a nuke was exploded inside a WH?
Cause the WH to flare as if a large ship had transited
Destroy the WH temporarily/permanently
Move the WH somewhere else in the systems
or connect a different pair of systems
Send a burst of EMF radiation around the WH (at one or both ends)
I have wondered about the WH’s and how they were created, and if there was a way
using the grav tech to disrupt or even close a WH with it. they are basically a black hole
that has connected to another in the same universe, or with a couple between universes,
I don’t know, there is so little understanding of how they work, how they are created,
to attempt to affect one. It’s like watching an ape try to figure out how to use a laptop,
do you smash the keys, jump on it, or throw poop at it?
As far as a nuke goes, it’s just as likely the force of the blast at best, would just travel
through it and get adsorbed in the other universe rather than travel through. The WH
is massive, the “safe” part they use isn’t the full size. Picture a tunnel you can drive
through a mountain, the tunnel is the part you can travel in, but the tunnel is part
of the mountain. A black hole is the mountain, the tunnel is the WH. the biggest nuke
we could make would be no more than a blasting cap to it. Sure you might knock a
few rocks loose, even cause an avalanche and block it, but it would take a lot more
to close it completely. which would explain why no WH goes to a system that has had
a supernova go off in.
white holes are pure theory! no one has a workable idea..
WH are a pure guess.! “If a BH exists that a WH has too.”
BH = nothing escapes.. WH = nothing can get in.