As a former history teacher, I have tried to explain everything
that is wrong with the idea of reparations. And that’s not even
touching on the disaster it would be for those who receive,
or are perceived to have received, any large sums of money as
reparations. And we won’t mention that in 10 years, you
probably would be unable to see any real improvement of
social conditions for the recipients. To think otherwise is to
show a lack of understanding of the nature of wealth. And no
one would ever dare pass a reparations act without ensuring
that the recipients would be unable to make any other demand
on the other 88 percent of the American population for any
further unearned remuneration. Will it happen someday?
It might; there are still idiots in office, and a population who has
discovered they can vote themselves bread and circuses.
Oh they pay some attention, then re-write it to suit them.
Or destroying things like that statue of Gen. Lee
because it reminds everyone of their stupidity…
President Elect Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH Neanderthal B Woodman Domestic Violent Extremist SuperStraight
As the update goes, “I never owned no slaves,
and you never picked no cotton.”
And if you want to go further, “You already
got your reparations in welfare, set asides,
affirmative action, Section 8, and who knows
what else.”
“And looking at you, I want a refund.”
I will never defend treating people as livestock,
but that wasn’t this country’s “original sin”.
Treating people as vermin to be removed came first.
I think genocide outranks even slavery.
So, yeah, learn from history. ALL of it.
Sorry, Jochi, but what you are describing is exactly how every immigrating
group has treated the indigenes of whatever territory the new group was
moving into. There was no systematic genocide. There was just the same
interaction between competing groups which has gone on from time out
of memory. Hell! The North American indigenes were doing it to one
another long before Europeans ever set foot here. Case in point. The
Apache used to live in what is now west Texas. Then the Commanche,
having mastered the equestrian arts, kicked the Apache out of what
had been their home range. Nothing new there. And I doubt the
Apache went peacefully. SOSDD. I refuse to feel guilty for events of
centuries ago.
Wasn’t saying you should feel guilty, Bill. Wasn’t saying punishing
those alive now makes any sense here either. WAS saying that if
reparations are seriously considered, there are others that have a
prior and stronger claim. Heinous as it was, slavery probably saved
the lives of conquered people the Arabs or other black peoples might
not have otherwise had a reason to keep alive. Can’t say the same
about reservations/internment camps/smallpox incubators.
I think they have already got their “share”, back in the early ’80s I
was in the unemployment office (which also doubled as the SSI office)
and watched a woman walk in and up to the SSI counter to get her
check. She had 6 kids maybe a year apart and a baby in her arms AND
very pregnant get her check, and then go back out to get into a gold
caddy…
From what I could see the guy driving was either a pimp or liked the look.
Panel 4 – PC, in just a few words, you have once again imparted
much wisdom. My father’s side arrived from Ireland in 1880; my
mother’s side earlier, but they were all well above the Mason-
Dixon line. Not a slave-owner among them. My family doesn’t
owe anybody anything for what might have been done to their
ancestors.
One of my Dad’s uncles traced our line back to an Irishman who
immigrated circa 1720. My line was always dirt poor and so never
was able to own more than the small patch of land their home
was on. On my Momma’s side my Grandfather immigrated from
Norway in the 19 teens. No evidence any of my ancestors were
ever wealthy to own slaves. My wife’s family is the same. Even
if it were somehow possible to inherit guilt a century and a half
after the fact neither my wife nor I would bear such. Woodman’s
quote, “I never owned no slaves, and you never picked no cotton.”
is entirely applicable. I’m no Bible thumper but the Bible has a
passage that lays out the principle perfectly. In the book of
“Ezekiel” chapter 18 verse 20 the principle is explained.
“The soul who sins dies. The son won’t bear the punishment
of his father’s sin and the father won’t bear the punishment
of his son’s sin. The righteous deeds of that righteous person
will be attributed to him, while the wicked deeds of the wicked
person will be charged against him.” By the way, the principle
in tort law is of damage to someone by someone else. The
quote Woodman wrote would exclude anybody living today
from either deserving or owing any sort of compensation.
You have to be a little careful about making those assumptions.
I thought my family was all from Michigan and fairly recent arrivals
from Denmark, etc. Turned out my mother was wrong about who
my father was. (I guess she couldn’t count to nine.) Not the
Michigander I thought, but rather a descendant of one of the early
Mississippi families, by way of Scotland, England, and Ireland,
Massachusetts, Virginia, North Carolina, Alabama, and Mississippi.
And sure enough, some of those ancestors owned slaves. And
maybe did more than just own them…turns out I have about 1%
black blood, so either someone was “passing,” or some child didn’t
have the mother or father (both instances were known to happen)
they thought they did. When do I get my reparations (working on
the one drop of black blood makes you black rule)?
Well, I know where my Dad’s family came from. There are still folks
with my last name living in the county where my grandpa was born
and grew up. I know where both of my grandmothers were born and
where they grew up. We have been poor since forever.
Remember while slavery was common the majority of people –
even Southerners – were not slave owners.
President Elect Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH Neanderthal B Woodman Domestic Violent Extremist SuperStraight
And there were even BLACK slave
owners that owned WHITE slaves.
So the question of who owes reparations
to whom becomes a spaghetti mess.
Or a Gordian knot.
Most Chinese were “debt slaves” to the railroads when the
first railroads were being built across the county. As were
the Irish. Both Japan and China were fond of making slaves
out of the defeated army’s and royals of a feuding kingdoms.
I know where my father’s family was from, 100% German. My grand
father immigrated right after WWI, my grand mother came when
she was a teenager. My mother’s side were mostly from Missouri
however.
my sperm doner sed we came over on the Mayflower.. yeah right.!
in the 80’s school had ‘ancestry revival’ so i looked up the family
name, and found, 3 brothers came over in the war of 1812,.
when they landed in Rochester, most of the conscripts deserted.!
so,,, they followed suit, but apparently they took half the company
payroll with them,. they fled west to the Spanish territory west of
the Mississippi.. oh and never bothered to change their name…
President Elect Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH Neanderthal B Woodman Domestic Violent Extremist SuperStraight
Now THAT would make an excellent family story to document,
write down, and laugh about at family gatherings.
Right up there with the other bank robbers and horse thieves.
oh i did.. and got banned from gatherings…
upset that not so lawful,. but,, happy that we were part of the
city founding,,. “Claim Club” but kept name out because they
were still ‘British loyalist outlaws.’..
oh, and OK with the natives, (was Indian land),
cuz they all married local squaws. an kept em happy…
If you have Danish ancestors, you probably have Viking ancestors
who raided for and traded slaves – generally not from Africa.
But if you have ancestors from _anywhere_ (as we all do),
you probably have slaves and slave owners in your ancestry.
There were areas that were worse than others,
but the southern USA barely rates for that list.
Ancient Greece and Rome had economies based on slave labor,
and they didn’t care what color, nationality, or religion
their slaves were. They’d maneuver their own neighbors into
borrowing more than they could repay, then enslave them –
because they always “needed” more slaves to do all the work
that free men would demand high pay for.
But the Arabs and Africans were the worst. Africans would sell
their own brother to slave traders, mostly Arab Muslims. Muslims
weren’t allowed to enslave Muslims, but the Arabs called blacks
“Kaffirs” – unbelievers – so they could ignore that many of them
were Muslims. They also raided all over Europe and the accessible
parts of Asia for slaves, but sub-Saharan Africa was the richest
source of slaves, and trading and raiding went on there for over
a thousand years.
An excellent statement against reparations, I feel it’s pointless at
this time to expect them, both the victims and those responsible
are long dead. And they are quick to forget the tribes that caught
them in the first place, or the fact there were more white/oriental
than black slaves in those days.
Can’t help but to love Mala, or the Empress’ Own for that matter.
They do NOT mess around or tolerate any threat to Teresa!
Mala is right about the actions needed, these clowns are
attacking solely because a “Demon whore” has taken
command of a country that they desire, so taking her and
killing her followers is “mandated” for them to teach her
the errors of her ways and teach any survivors the “truth”
of Allah… If they aren’t all killed they will just rebuild and
try again. We’ve seen this behavior in RL enough to know.
President Elect Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH Neanderthal B Woodman Domestic Violent Extremist SuperStraight
I’m with Mala, “None shall survive.” The Empire doesn’t
have a large military force to restrain any prisoners.
Neither does the Empire have a large prison-industrial complex
to house, care for, and (attempt to) rehabilitate any prisoners.
And I’m pretty sure that these sand chiggers
aren’t rehabilitative in the first place.
And, again, with the mentality of these combatives, you DON’T want
to leave any behind you alive, even if you think they’re disabled.
Anything could happen such that the Empire might have to face
those same individuals again in combat.
Not a pretty picture. So, “None shall survive.”
A sad, but necessary, attitude for survival.
Fanatics are rarely saveable, they are so sure of their right to
behave like that, it takes far more effort to show them the light
than they are worth. More so if they are militant. Like these yahoos.
Remember that Saul was a fanatic before he became Paul, persecuted
Christians before he became one. I’ve read that the “true believer”
mindset when confronted with adequate pressure or counter-evidence
is far more likely to switch what they’re fanatical ABOUT than to be
cured.
Saul/Paul was a special case, he did speak to the right people
that could show him the error of his ways. Sadly, no one is
respected enough (in general) anymore for their words to carry
enough weight for any fanatical group to listen to them. These
types are more likely to yell out “Traitor!” or “Infidel!”and shoot
anyone that points out the obvious to them.
IMHO, ‘reparations’ should be in the form of passage
(Plane or ship tickets) to Liberia.
Their ancestors had the opportunity and turned it down.
Give them a second chance.
I agree 100%! The whole reparations thing is a massive grift.
The folks demanding reparations are professional grifters.
Reparations are just another con.
Dr. Thomas Sowell has some interesting thoughts about why
so many Blacks are in the condition they’re in.
Plenty of YouTube videos of Dr. Sowell explaining it.
“My great-great grand-daddy was a slave, you should give me things for that!”
Yeah no, no one alive today benefits from slavery from the 1700-to-1800s, so
how are we responsible for it? You’re totally right, just some loud-mouthed
whiners wanting free stuff for something they had nothing to do with. You want
free stuff? Here’s some lumber, so build a bridge and get over it!
There is a long-form history podcaster named Darryl Cooper.
His show is called Martyrmade. He is doing a series on slavery
from early man to the outbreak of the War for Southern
Independence (It does NOT fit the definition of a ‘civil war’).
I highly recommend the series.
As I read elsewhere, “every race of man has been held in slavery
at some time in history, only one has never gotten over it”.
she's not a bad teacher, herself.
As a former history teacher, I have tried to explain everything
that is wrong with the idea of reparations. And that’s not even
touching on the disaster it would be for those who receive,
or are perceived to have received, any large sums of money as
reparations. And we won’t mention that in 10 years, you
probably would be unable to see any real improvement of
social conditions for the recipients. To think otherwise is to
show a lack of understanding of the nature of wealth. And no
one would ever dare pass a reparations act without ensuring
that the recipients would be unable to make any other demand
on the other 88 percent of the American population for any
further unearned remuneration. Will it happen someday?
It might; there are still idiots in office, and a population who has
discovered they can vote themselves bread and circuses.
Yup, but who pays attention to history?
Not politicians anyway.
I don’t do political jokes.
They are all in office.
Oh they pay some attention, then re-write it to suit them.
Or destroying things like that statue of Gen. Lee
because it reminds everyone of their stupidity…
As the update goes, “I never owned no slaves,
and you never picked no cotton.”
And if you want to go further, “You already
got your reparations in welfare, set asides,
affirmative action, Section 8, and who knows
what else.”
“And looking at you, I want a refund.”
I will never defend treating people as livestock,
but that wasn’t this country’s “original sin”.
Treating people as vermin to be removed came first.
I think genocide outranks even slavery.
So, yeah, learn from history. ALL of it.
Sorry, Jochi, but what you are describing is exactly how every immigrating
group has treated the indigenes of whatever territory the new group was
moving into. There was no systematic genocide. There was just the same
interaction between competing groups which has gone on from time out
of memory. Hell! The North American indigenes were doing it to one
another long before Europeans ever set foot here. Case in point. The
Apache used to live in what is now west Texas. Then the Commanche,
having mastered the equestrian arts, kicked the Apache out of what
had been their home range. Nothing new there. And I doubt the
Apache went peacefully. SOSDD. I refuse to feel guilty for events of
centuries ago.
Wasn’t saying you should feel guilty, Bill. Wasn’t saying punishing
those alive now makes any sense here either. WAS saying that if
reparations are seriously considered, there are others that have a
prior and stronger claim. Heinous as it was, slavery probably saved
the lives of conquered people the Arabs or other black peoples might
not have otherwise had a reason to keep alive. Can’t say the same
about reservations/internment camps/smallpox incubators.
And whose budget would those payments come from?
What services would all of society not receive
because that money went to individuals?
I think they have already got their “share”, back in the early ’80s I
was in the unemployment office (which also doubled as the SSI office)
and watched a woman walk in and up to the SSI counter to get her
check. She had 6 kids maybe a year apart and a baby in her arms AND
very pregnant get her check, and then go back out to get into a gold
caddy…
From what I could see the guy driving was either a pimp or liked the look.
Excellent argument Chira.
There will be blood spilled.
Great discussion of the ridiculousness of reparations,
Catman. A most excellent brief exposition.
Oh, Chira isn’t done.
Panel 4 – PC, in just a few words, you have once again imparted
much wisdom. My father’s side arrived from Ireland in 1880; my
mother’s side earlier, but they were all well above the Mason-
Dixon line. Not a slave-owner among them. My family doesn’t
owe anybody anything for what might have been done to their
ancestors.
Mala – You do not threaten M’Lady and survive!
One of my Dad’s uncles traced our line back to an Irishman who
immigrated circa 1720. My line was always dirt poor and so never
was able to own more than the small patch of land their home
was on. On my Momma’s side my Grandfather immigrated from
Norway in the 19 teens. No evidence any of my ancestors were
ever wealthy to own slaves. My wife’s family is the same. Even
if it were somehow possible to inherit guilt a century and a half
after the fact neither my wife nor I would bear such. Woodman’s
quote, “I never owned no slaves, and you never picked no cotton.”
is entirely applicable. I’m no Bible thumper but the Bible has a
passage that lays out the principle perfectly. In the book of
“Ezekiel” chapter 18 verse 20 the principle is explained.
“The soul who sins dies. The son won’t bear the punishment
of his father’s sin and the father won’t bear the punishment
of his son’s sin. The righteous deeds of that righteous person
will be attributed to him, while the wicked deeds of the wicked
person will be charged against him.” By the way, the principle
in tort law is of damage to someone by someone else. The
quote Woodman wrote would exclude anybody living today
from either deserving or owing any sort of compensation.
You have to be a little careful about making those assumptions.
I thought my family was all from Michigan and fairly recent arrivals
from Denmark, etc. Turned out my mother was wrong about who
my father was. (I guess she couldn’t count to nine.) Not the
Michigander I thought, but rather a descendant of one of the early
Mississippi families, by way of Scotland, England, and Ireland,
Massachusetts, Virginia, North Carolina, Alabama, and Mississippi.
And sure enough, some of those ancestors owned slaves. And
maybe did more than just own them…turns out I have about 1%
black blood, so either someone was “passing,” or some child didn’t
have the mother or father (both instances were known to happen)
they thought they did. When do I get my reparations (working on
the one drop of black blood makes you black rule)?
Well, I know where my Dad’s family came from. There are still folks
with my last name living in the county where my grandpa was born
and grew up. I know where both of my grandmothers were born and
where they grew up. We have been poor since forever.
Remember while slavery was common the majority of people –
even Southerners – were not slave owners.
And there were even BLACK slave
owners that owned WHITE slaves.
So the question of who owes reparations
to whom becomes a spaghetti mess.
Or a Gordian knot.
Most Chinese were “debt slaves” to the railroads when the
first railroads were being built across the county. As were
the Irish. Both Japan and China were fond of making slaves
out of the defeated army’s and royals of a feuding kingdoms.
I know where my father’s family was from, 100% German. My grand
father immigrated right after WWI, my grand mother came when
she was a teenager. My mother’s side were mostly from Missouri
however.
my sperm doner sed we came over on the Mayflower.. yeah right.!
in the 80’s school had ‘ancestry revival’ so i looked up the family
name, and found, 3 brothers came over in the war of 1812,.
when they landed in Rochester, most of the conscripts deserted.!
so,,, they followed suit, but apparently they took half the company
payroll with them,. they fled west to the Spanish territory west of
the Mississippi.. oh and never bothered to change their name…
Now THAT would make an excellent family story to document,
write down, and laugh about at family gatherings.
Right up there with the other bank robbers and horse thieves.
oh i did.. and got banned from gatherings…
upset that not so lawful,. but,, happy that we were part of the
city founding,,. “Claim Club” but kept name out because they
were still ‘British loyalist outlaws.’..
oh, and OK with the natives, (was Indian land),
cuz they all married local squaws. an kept em happy…
If you have Danish ancestors, you probably have Viking ancestors
who raided for and traded slaves – generally not from Africa.
But if you have ancestors from _anywhere_ (as we all do),
you probably have slaves and slave owners in your ancestry.
There were areas that were worse than others,
but the southern USA barely rates for that list.
Ancient Greece and Rome had economies based on slave labor,
and they didn’t care what color, nationality, or religion
their slaves were. They’d maneuver their own neighbors into
borrowing more than they could repay, then enslave them –
because they always “needed” more slaves to do all the work
that free men would demand high pay for.
But the Arabs and Africans were the worst. Africans would sell
their own brother to slave traders, mostly Arab Muslims. Muslims
weren’t allowed to enslave Muslims, but the Arabs called blacks
“Kaffirs” – unbelievers – so they could ignore that many of them
were Muslims. They also raided all over Europe and the accessible
parts of Asia for slaves, but sub-Saharan Africa was the richest
source of slaves, and trading and raiding went on there for over
a thousand years.
An excellent statement against reparations, I feel it’s pointless at
this time to expect them, both the victims and those responsible
are long dead. And they are quick to forget the tribes that caught
them in the first place, or the fact there were more white/oriental
than black slaves in those days.
Can’t help but to love Mala, or the Empress’ Own for that matter.
They do NOT mess around or tolerate any threat to Teresa!
Mala is right about the actions needed, these clowns are
attacking solely because a “Demon whore” has taken
command of a country that they desire, so taking her and
killing her followers is “mandated” for them to teach her
the errors of her ways and teach any survivors the “truth”
of Allah… If they aren’t all killed they will just rebuild and
try again. We’ve seen this behavior in RL enough to know.
I’m with Mala, “None shall survive.” The Empire doesn’t
have a large military force to restrain any prisoners.
Neither does the Empire have a large prison-industrial complex
to house, care for, and (attempt to) rehabilitate any prisoners.
And I’m pretty sure that these sand chiggers
aren’t rehabilitative in the first place.
And, again, with the mentality of these combatives, you DON’T want
to leave any behind you alive, even if you think they’re disabled.
Anything could happen such that the Empire might have to face
those same individuals again in combat.
Not a pretty picture. So, “None shall survive.”
A sad, but necessary, attitude for survival.
Fanatics are rarely saveable, they are so sure of their right to
behave like that, it takes far more effort to show them the light
than they are worth. More so if they are militant. Like these yahoos.
Remember that Saul was a fanatic before he became Paul, persecuted
Christians before he became one. I’ve read that the “true believer”
mindset when confronted with adequate pressure or counter-evidence
is far more likely to switch what they’re fanatical ABOUT than to be
cured.
Saul/Paul was a special case, he did speak to the right people
that could show him the error of his ways. Sadly, no one is
respected enough (in general) anymore for their words to carry
enough weight for any fanatical group to listen to them. These
types are more likely to yell out “Traitor!” or “Infidel!”and shoot
anyone that points out the obvious to them.
IMHO, ‘reparations’ should be in the form of passage
(Plane or ship tickets) to Liberia.
Their ancestors had the opportunity and turned it down.
Give them a second chance.
I agree 100%! The whole reparations thing is a massive grift.
The folks demanding reparations are professional grifters.
Reparations are just another con.
Dr. Thomas Sowell has some interesting thoughts about why
so many Blacks are in the condition they’re in.
Plenty of YouTube videos of Dr. Sowell explaining it.
“My great-great grand-daddy was a slave, you should give me things for that!”
Yeah no, no one alive today benefits from slavery from the 1700-to-1800s, so
how are we responsible for it? You’re totally right, just some loud-mouthed
whiners wanting free stuff for something they had nothing to do with. You want
free stuff? Here’s some lumber, so build a bridge and get over it!
There is a long-form history podcaster named Darryl Cooper.
His show is called Martyrmade. He is doing a series on slavery
from early man to the outbreak of the War for Southern
Independence (It does NOT fit the definition of a ‘civil war’).
I highly recommend the series.
As I read elsewhere, “every race of man has been held in slavery
at some time in history, only one has never gotten over it”.
Case in point.
https://satwcomic.com/can-you-imagine-the-clipshow